No, but you should be able to use it with a electric clothes dryer, those things are usually 30A at 240V, so you should be able to get away with an efficiency as low as 60%
The issue there is the heating elements and motor. Modern DC power supplies will work with a wide range of AC input; motors are pickier about their input power and voltage regulation for resistive heating elements is harder because they've got such a large power draw.
Correct! This power supply is a "switching" basically meaning it's adjustable. Things with heating elements like hair dryers are not normal able to work on a different voltage. Even close voltages of a different country because they are often designed to be "hard wired" into a specific region's voltage for efficiency. Meaning there is not a power adapter changing the voltage or current going into the heating wire. The wire was designed by material, width and length so that it heats up a desired way.
Even 500W Bronze PSU is enough for high-end single-GPU gaming rig. I was playing with a 2600X Overclocked to 4.2 GHz on all cores and a Vega 56 overclocked to 1600 MHz and I was using an EVGA Bronze 500W PSU with actual rating on 12V+ of 480W. I was actually using a bit over 500W at the wall but I figured that's fine cuz it's rated for output wattage of 480, and input is higher due to PSU "inefficiency". Anyway what I'm saying is it's not hard to understand why they wont sell this, well it's shame for the two, maybe three people that'd buy it.
This stuff so much. PSU wattage is generally a delusional chase of meaninglessly higher numbers by people too clueless to stuff their brain in gear. This one is, thankfully, going to go into the hands of "extreme" overclockers and will get tossed around as a corporate sponsorship thing so pretty much no one in the real world will notice or care that it exists.
Maybe they could make it have two 120v plugs, that you could connect up to different sockets. I have no idea about electrical circuitry in the house, so not sure if that would work.
That'd be seriously unsafe. You'd have people trying to put both plugs into the same branch circuit and tripping the breaker under load just as if they used a single cord.
It wouldn't trip the break if the PSU is designed properly. It mentioned 230v only. So you'd have to plug in to outlets on separate phases (US and other countries using split phase). If you plugged in to the same phase, you'd only be getting 120v still.
Or run a 240v outlet. It is possible to do 15A 240v. I know there is a standard out there for it, though I've never seen one in person (smallest I've seen 240v is 30amp. 20 and 15A 240v in the US is almost always hardwired equipment like well pumps, motors, A/C compressors, air handlers, etc.).
Well, I guess not many sockets are wired that way, though? In Germany (and Bosnia) we have many homes wired with 3 phase 230V (~400V) for high powered items like stoves and heaters. But that is just a few special sockets in a home. Normal Schukos are still just 230V.
3 phase almost never comes into residential property in the US (exceptions are for serious wood/metal working hobbyists who have really high ends tools). Instead what we have is 230V single phase; which other than for a handful of major appliances is split in half into two 115V parts.
No, they average 240v. It is alternating current. NA three-phase power is separated by 120 degrees true. However, what you see is voltage that alternates from a lot of 0v to a high of 170v for 120v. For 240v it is a low of 0v and a high of 340v. All alternating currents used (that I am aware of) are expressed as the root mean square. That means that over the course of the voltage sinewave it averages to the stated voltage.
Some of the time the voltage is 0, sometimes it is 340v. It averages out to 240v.
It is split phase because it is delivered 120v on two conductors that are in phase, but have opposite voltage signs. So when one voltage is peaked at +170v, the other conductor has a -170v current on it. That is additive to a difference of 340v. The root mean square of the entire voltage sine wave between the two is a difference of 240v. If you connect only one of the conductors, you'd get a root mean square of only 120v.
The transformer outside of your house pulls power from only one of the three phases traveling on the conductors. What travels on the power lines, even residential is in the thousands of volts on each phase. It is stepped down to 240v split phase. In some commercial buildings and some special residential installations (IE REALLY big houses) it is delivered as full 3-phase power (still split, IE on two supply conductors and a neutral/return/ground conductor) at 240v. Industrial needs and what not get supplies in the thousands of volts with special installations where the supply voltage isn't stepped down (or isn't stepped down as far).
Typically you can get up to 360/400A delivered residentially (dual pedestal meter). 360A is sustained, 400A surge. Bigger residential installations will use this (my house has dual 200A service off the meter to two panels). I believe the maximum is a 6 pedestal meter (in the US) for larger commercial installations. You get 3-phase power from that and you are talking 864kw maximum delivered power (well, surge, I think the limit would still be 777,600 watts continuous).
I suspect if you also had that setup, you'd need unique power delivery from your utility company. But I imagine there are plenty of large commercial office buildings that use a large fraction of ~777kw.
Too expensive. Besides, the rest of the world does use 240v (much of the world uses 230v, which is slightly less efficient than 240v). It is just used only for high power draw equipment and some permanently installed equipment (for efficiency on the later).
For instance my air handlers are on a 15a/240v circuit (don't make breakers of less than 15a. They draw about 2A@240v). My A/C compressors are on 20a/240v circuits (those draw I think around 10-12A@240v IIRC). My range/oven is on a 50A/240V circuit. Clothes dryer is 30A/240V. (oil water heater, or else an electric one would be on a 30A/240V circuit also). Well pump is on a 15A/240V circuit (draws about 2.5A@240v).
If you are going to upgrade, might as well just switch everything over to DC current while you are at it. Massively larger efficiencies to be gained from DC power generation, transmission, delivery and use than some stuff in your house using 120v.
I haven't done the math in awhile, but with typical conductor sizes in a US house you are wasting something like 3-5% of your power in heat dissipation in your wiring on average. That takes in to account high draw appliances like electric ovens, water heaters and driers that are pulling 20-40 amps at 240V. Most 120v stuff is generally fairly low draw and spread over multiple circuits. So the overall loss in wiring is relatively low.
You'd gain as much by switching to DC power use within the home (1 or 2%. Maybe) as you would switching everything to 240V within the home.
Now power delivery...you'd likely save 5-8% by switching to high voltage DC compared to alternating current.
Exactly 17 countries are running 240V, 7 of which are small islands.
The dominant voltage used to be 220V. EU harmonized to 230V from the UK 240V and the 220V of the rest of Europe in 1995. Some countries have followed, some remain at 220V - China and Russia being the largest.
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24 Comments
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shabby - Monday, June 3, 2019 - link
Does it come with a dryer plug for us Americans?basroil - Monday, June 3, 2019 - link
No, but you should be able to use it with a electric clothes dryer, those things are usually 30A at 240V, so you should be able to get away with an efficiency as low as 60%s.yu - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
Is 240V compatible with the international 220-230V voltage with a mere plug change?Santoval - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
It is. The standard voltage range is 220 to 240V, with an average of 230V. So devices are calibrated around the average voltage.s.yu - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Very interesting...well I know that some 100V appliances made for Japan don't work on US 110V-120V, Dyson Supersonic for example.DanNeely - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
The issue there is the heating elements and motor. Modern DC power supplies will work with a wide range of AC input; motors are pickier about their input power and voltage regulation for resistive heating elements is harder because they've got such a large power draw.Skeptical123 - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Correct! This power supply is a "switching" basically meaning it's adjustable. Things with heating elements like hair dryers are not normal able to work on a different voltage. Even close voltages of a different country because they are often designed to be "hard wired" into a specific region's voltage for efficiency. Meaning there is not a power adapter changing the voltage or current going into the heating wire. The wire was designed by material, width and length so that it heats up a desired way.meacupla - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
Assuming your home is wired up for 30A, the PSU would also need a special power cable that can handle 30A.AshlayW - Monday, June 3, 2019 - link
Even 500W Bronze PSU is enough for high-end single-GPU gaming rig. I was playing with a 2600X Overclocked to 4.2 GHz on all cores and a Vega 56 overclocked to 1600 MHz and I was using an EVGA Bronze 500W PSU with actual rating on 12V+ of 480W. I was actually using a bit over 500W at the wall but I figured that's fine cuz it's rated for output wattage of 480, and input is higher due to PSU "inefficiency". Anyway what I'm saying is it's not hard to understand why they wont sell this, well it's shame for the two, maybe three people that'd buy it.PeachNCream - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
This stuff so much. PSU wattage is generally a delusional chase of meaninglessly higher numbers by people too clueless to stuff their brain in gear. This one is, thankfully, going to go into the hands of "extreme" overclockers and will get tossed around as a corporate sponsorship thing so pretty much no one in the real world will notice or care that it exists.khanikun - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
Maybe they could make it have two 120v plugs, that you could connect up to different sockets. I have no idea about electrical circuitry in the house, so not sure if that would work.qlum - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
On thw box I see no mention of 120v support so probably not. Besides tjat a setup like that is asking for user error.PeachNCream - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
240v is on the PSU label and the plug shape is physically different. You'd have to try really hard to mess that one up.nils_ - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
That will usually not work since multiple sockets are usually on the same circuit (say one per room for example).DanNeely - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
That'd be seriously unsafe. You'd have people trying to put both plugs into the same branch circuit and tripping the breaker under load just as if they used a single cord.azazel1024 - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
It wouldn't trip the break if the PSU is designed properly. It mentioned 230v only. So you'd have to plug in to outlets on separate phases (US and other countries using split phase). If you plugged in to the same phase, you'd only be getting 120v still.Or run a 240v outlet. It is possible to do 15A 240v. I know there is a standard out there for it, though I've never seen one in person (smallest I've seen 240v is 30amp. 20 and 15A 240v in the US is almost always hardwired equipment like well pumps, motors, A/C compressors, air handlers, etc.).
qlum - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
I keep forgetting the 120v low current output is US homes is a thing and a real issue for high powered devicesmeacupla - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
The NA power system is 120VAC, but it's three-phase, three-wire, so it in fact can do 120VAC and 240VAC.The catch is that due to the phases being 120degrees apart (out of 360 degrees) from each other, they never hit 240V and only hit more like 200~220V.
Death666Angel - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
Well, I guess not many sockets are wired that way, though? In Germany (and Bosnia) we have many homes wired with 3 phase 230V (~400V) for high powered items like stoves and heaters. But that is just a few special sockets in a home. Normal Schukos are still just 230V.DanNeely - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
3 phase almost never comes into residential property in the US (exceptions are for serious wood/metal working hobbyists who have really high ends tools). Instead what we have is 230V single phase; which other than for a handful of major appliances is split in half into two 115V parts.azazel1024 - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
No, they average 240v. It is alternating current. NA three-phase power is separated by 120 degrees true. However, what you see is voltage that alternates from a lot of 0v to a high of 170v for 120v. For 240v it is a low of 0v and a high of 340v. All alternating currents used (that I am aware of) are expressed as the root mean square. That means that over the course of the voltage sinewave it averages to the stated voltage.Some of the time the voltage is 0, sometimes it is 340v. It averages out to 240v.
It is split phase because it is delivered 120v on two conductors that are in phase, but have opposite voltage signs. So when one voltage is peaked at +170v, the other conductor has a -170v current on it. That is additive to a difference of 340v. The root mean square of the entire voltage sine wave between the two is a difference of 240v. If you connect only one of the conductors, you'd get a root mean square of only 120v.
The transformer outside of your house pulls power from only one of the three phases traveling on the conductors. What travels on the power lines, even residential is in the thousands of volts on each phase. It is stepped down to 240v split phase. In some commercial buildings and some special residential installations (IE REALLY big houses) it is delivered as full 3-phase power (still split, IE on two supply conductors and a neutral/return/ground conductor) at 240v. Industrial needs and what not get supplies in the thousands of volts with special installations where the supply voltage isn't stepped down (or isn't stepped down as far).
Typically you can get up to 360/400A delivered residentially (dual pedestal meter). 360A is sustained, 400A surge. Bigger residential installations will use this (my house has dual 200A service off the meter to two panels). I believe the maximum is a 6 pedestal meter (in the US) for larger commercial installations. You get 3-phase power from that and you are talking 864kw maximum delivered power (well, surge, I think the limit would still be 777,600 watts continuous).
I suspect if you also had that setup, you'd need unique power delivery from your utility company. But I imagine there are plenty of large commercial office buildings that use a large fraction of ~777kw.
akvadrako - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
Time for the rest of the world to upgrade to 240V.azazel1024 - Tuesday, June 4, 2019 - link
Too expensive. Besides, the rest of the world does use 240v (much of the world uses 230v, which is slightly less efficient than 240v). It is just used only for high power draw equipment and some permanently installed equipment (for efficiency on the later).For instance my air handlers are on a 15a/240v circuit (don't make breakers of less than 15a. They draw about 2A@240v). My A/C compressors are on 20a/240v circuits (those draw I think around 10-12A@240v IIRC). My range/oven is on a 50A/240V circuit. Clothes dryer is 30A/240V. (oil water heater, or else an electric one would be on a 30A/240V circuit also). Well pump is on a 15A/240V circuit (draws about 2.5A@240v).
If you are going to upgrade, might as well just switch everything over to DC current while you are at it. Massively larger efficiencies to be gained from DC power generation, transmission, delivery and use than some stuff in your house using 120v.
I haven't done the math in awhile, but with typical conductor sizes in a US house you are wasting something like 3-5% of your power in heat dissipation in your wiring on average. That takes in to account high draw appliances like electric ovens, water heaters and driers that are pulling 20-40 amps at 240V. Most 120v stuff is generally fairly low draw and spread over multiple circuits. So the overall loss in wiring is relatively low.
You'd gain as much by switching to DC power use within the home (1 or 2%. Maybe) as you would switching everything to 240V within the home.
Now power delivery...you'd likely save 5-8% by switching to high voltage DC compared to alternating current.
Hul8 - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
I just counted here:https://www.worldstandards.eu/electricity/plug-vol...
Exactly 17 countries are running 240V, 7 of which are small islands.
The dominant voltage used to be 220V. EU harmonized to 230V from the UK 240V and the 220V of the rest of Europe in 1995. Some countries have followed, some remain at 220V - China and Russia being the largest.